Heaven? And Hell?

redneF
atheistRational VIP!
redneF's picture
Posts: 1971
Joined: 2011-01-04
User is offlineOffline
Heaven? And Hell?

WTF?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5vPnMbLr5nc&feature=relmfu

Now, how can any theist give any moral justification for this?

 

I keep asking myself " Are they just playin' stupid, or are they just plain stupid?..."

"To explain the unknown by the known is a logical procedure; to explain the known by the unknown is a form of theological lunacy" : David Brooks

" Only on the subject of God can smart people still imagine that they reap the fruits of human intelligence even as they plow them under." : Sam Harris


TGBaker
atheist
TGBaker's picture
Posts: 1367
Joined: 2011-02-06
User is offlineOffline
redneF

redneF wrote:

WTF?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5vPnMbLr5nc&feature=relmfu

Now, how can any theist give any moral justification for this?

 

Dud you have to look at the belief (argument ) and its premise. These beliefs cause people to do this shit all the time.  Kill the son to make sure he goes to heaven because his behavior might  mean he'll follow Satan. Be willing to burn in hell for murder so that you can assure your son will be in heaven.  Good logic bad premise.  Answer religion followed out logically is sick and delusional, dangerous and harmful.   A man here in Atlanta took a hammer and applied it to his two sleeping children so they would be in a better place than this.


 

"You can't write a chord ugly enough to say what you want to say sometimes, so you have to rely on a giraffe filled with whip cream."--Frank Zappa

http://atheisticgod.blogspot.com/ Books on atheism


Thunderios
atheist
Posts: 261
Joined: 2010-12-26
User is offlineOffline
I wouldn't say that this has

I wouldn't say that this has happened due to her believing until I saw some statistics on how often it happens with religious people versus irreligious people, and a way to show that the causation isn't the other way around (she believed because she was nuts, she wasn't nuts because she believed).
I clearly remember how a christian came to our forum and said a serial killer said he was justified by evolution. They have as much right to call bullshit on this statement as we had on that one.


redneF
atheistRational VIP!
redneF's picture
Posts: 1971
Joined: 2011-01-04
User is offlineOffline
TGBaker wrote:Dud you have

TGBaker wrote:
Dud you have to look at the belief (argument ) and its premise. These beliefs cause people to do this shit all the time.  Kill the son to make sure he goes to heaven because his behavior might  mean he'll follow Satan. Be willing to burn in hell for murder so that you can assure your son will be in heaven.  Good logic bad premise.  Answer religion followed out logically is sick and delusional, dangerous and harmful.   A man here in Atlanta took a hammer and applied it to his two sleeping children so they would be in a better place than this.
 

 

So, it proves that religion is 'good', and that they are 'rational', and 'logical' in their behaviour, because they are only preventing their kids from 'sinning', which is what their god wants?

What a convoluted pile of horsesh1t...

 

I keep asking myself " Are they just playin' stupid, or are they just plain stupid?..."

"To explain the unknown by the known is a logical procedure; to explain the known by the unknown is a form of theological lunacy" : David Brooks

" Only on the subject of God can smart people still imagine that they reap the fruits of human intelligence even as they plow them under." : Sam Harris


Ktulu
atheist
Posts: 1830
Joined: 2010-12-21
User is offlineOffline
 One of the links from that

 One of the links from that video... 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1JfNUvgEsoE&feature=relmfu

some idiot killed a toddler because he was possessed by demons.  If only Jesus was around to exorcise the toddler... he's probably busy making wine out of water in France somewhere.  Those awesomely expensive wines don't make themselves. 

 

"Don't seek these laws to understand. Only the mad can comprehend..." -- George Cosbuc


TGBaker
atheist
TGBaker's picture
Posts: 1367
Joined: 2011-02-06
User is offlineOffline
Thunderios wrote:I wouldn't

Thunderios wrote:

I wouldn't say that this has happened due to her believing until I saw some statistics on how often it happens with religious people versus irreligious people, and a way to show that the causation isn't the other way around (she believed because she was nuts, she wasn't nuts because she believed).
I clearly remember how a christian came to our forum and said a serial killer said he was justified by evolution. They have as much right to call bullshit on this statement as we had on that one.

[2] In contrast to the preventative argument, some dimensions of religiosity have been proposed as sources of violence in one form or another. Religious zeal has been cited as a source of national and international problems, ranging from homicide, hate crime, and terrorism to genocide and ethnic cleansing. Reflecting upon When Religion Becomes Evil, Charles Kimball proposes that religious belief systems tend to become destructive when they are characterized by absolute truth claims, notions of a cosmic struggle between God and the Devil (cosmic dualism), and rigid dichotomies between good and evil. In short, when certain types of religious attitudes predominate in a nation, Kimball’s argument suggests that they can contribute to an inclination towards interpersonal violence.

[3] Gregory Paul most recently highlighted the view that religious variables can have negative consequences. In an analysis of eighteen prosperous nations, Paul reports positive relationships between a variety of measures of religiosity and homicide rates as well as other social problems. He concludes that secular nations have lower homicide rates and less serious social problems than found in the United States. His conclusions were based on an examination of scatter-plots for a small set of nations with no attempt to consider alternative explanations nor to encompass the research in the larger body of sociological theory and research on the topic.

http://moses.creighton.edu/JRS/2006/2006-7.html

There seems to be higher homicide with those that believe in both God and the Devil than those believing in only a god.

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/uk/article571206.ece

 

"You can't write a chord ugly enough to say what you want to say sometimes, so you have to rely on a giraffe filled with whip cream."--Frank Zappa

http://atheisticgod.blogspot.com/ Books on atheism


Rich Woods
Rational VIP!
Rich Woods's picture
Posts: 868
Joined: 2008-02-06
User is offlineOffline
Damn... Thought it was about

Damn... Thought it was about this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NUJH7y1yK_E


TGBaker
atheist
TGBaker's picture
Posts: 1367
Joined: 2011-02-06
User is offlineOffline
Rich Woods wrote:Damn...

Rich Woods wrote:

Damn... Thought it was about this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NUJH7y1yK_E

Hey that wasn't Ozzy. That don't count.


 

"You can't write a chord ugly enough to say what you want to say sometimes, so you have to rely on a giraffe filled with whip cream."--Frank Zappa

http://atheisticgod.blogspot.com/ Books on atheism


butterbattle
ModeratorSuperfan
butterbattle's picture
Posts: 3719
Joined: 2008-09-12
User is offlineOffline
http://killtheafterlife.blogs

http://killtheafterlife.blogspot.com/2006/07/andrea-yates-true-death-denying.html

Most Christians would be appalled by this. Nevertheless, I think if a Christian truly believed that innocent children go to heaven, then the logical conclusion must be that the ultimate selfless sacrifice is to murder all of your children. Though you may damn yourself, you guarantee your children eternal bliss with God. It is quite tragic and moving, that in the end, the honest Christian mother, who cares for her kids more than anything else in the world, realized that the best course of action, what would really give her what she wants, would be for her to disobey God's morality and save her kids.     

+1 for Christian morality.
 

 

Our revels now are ended. These our actors, | As I foretold you, were all spirits, and | Are melted into air, into thin air; | And, like the baseless fabric of this vision, | The cloud-capped towers, the gorgeous palaces, | The solemn temples, the great globe itself, - Yea, all which it inherit, shall dissolve, | And, like this insubstantial pageant faded, | Leave not a rack behind. We are such stuff | As dreams are made on, and our little life | Is rounded with a sleep. - Shakespeare


TGBaker
atheist
TGBaker's picture
Posts: 1367
Joined: 2011-02-06
User is offlineOffline
butterbattle

butterbattle wrote:

http://killtheafterlife.blogspot.com/2006/07/andrea-yates-true-death-denying.html

Most Christians would be appalled by this. Nevertheless, I think if a Christian truly believed that innocent children go to heaven, then the logical conclusion must be that the ultimate selfless sacrifice is to murder all of your children. Though you may damn yourself, you guarantee your children eternal bliss with God. It is quite tragic and moving, that in the end, the honest Christian mother, who cares for her kids more than anything else in the world, realized that the best course of action, what would really give her what she wants, would be for her to disobey God's morality and save her kids.     

+1 for Christian morality.
 

 

Yep and that was probably what this mother did. I've seen it numerous times. I was a social worker for 20 years. The logic is rational if the premise is true. Save them while they are innocent.  Do not kid yourselves the meme runs amuk through history, movies and the minds of believers.


 

"You can't write a chord ugly enough to say what you want to say sometimes, so you have to rely on a giraffe filled with whip cream."--Frank Zappa

http://atheisticgod.blogspot.com/ Books on atheism


mrOriginal
atheist
mrOriginal's picture
Posts: 80
Joined: 2011-02-26
User is offlineOffline
Yet another reason why I

Yet another reason why I consider relgious people to suffer from mental illness.  It is a mass sickness, that shows its ugly face in small ways.  I was stunned when I watched this video, that poor boy.  As awful as it is, we need reminders like this to let remind all of us how gratefull we should be for having rational minds not clouded by religious dogma that can help justify doing something so terrible.

 

 

" A casual stroll through the insane-asylum shows that faith proves nothing"

Friedrich Nietzsche.

"Whoever feels predestined to see and not to believe will find all believers too noisy and pushy: he guards against them."

Friedrich Nietzsche


Ktulu
atheist
Posts: 1830
Joined: 2010-12-21
User is offlineOffline
 All he had to do to save

 All he had to do to save his life was denounce the holy ghost.  Then his mom wouldn't have killed him, kind of sad actually

"Don't seek these laws to understand. Only the mad can comprehend..." -- George Cosbuc