spirituality and sense of wonder

robj101
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spirituality and sense of wonder

We are supposed to be made in gods image, where are our flashy extra parts? I wonder if a theist would ever get that little shiver of discovery if they really think hard on the human form, about how it is fit exactly as nature would have it in an imperfect manner on this planet. I say shiver of discovery, I don't know what you call it when thet feeling comes over you that says you have hit on something. This happened to me years ago but I still remember it well, in a way it's a humbling scary feeling but then it becomes clear and you are happy with knowing. I doubt a theist gets that at all /shrug* "god did it".

I got this feeling once while contemplaing how miniscule we are in the universe once, seems like I could almost grasp it but not quite. Our brains are simply not wired for it..yet.

I could almost see it correlating with "spirituality" strangely enough.

The only "extra parts" we have are fading remnants from our evolution, as if I need to mention that.

 

Faith is the word but next to that snugged up closely "lie's" the want.
"By simple common sense I don't believe in god, in none."-Charlie Chaplin


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The idea that 'spirituality'

The idea that 'spirituality' has a monopoly on our sense of wonder is bullshit. Wonder is an emotion that all humans can and do feel. There is no need to believe in anything supernatural to appreciate the wonders of the universe.

Check out some of my writings on the subject:

Taking a Step Beyond Awe

What is Wonderism?

Wonderism, Pragmatism, and Prediction

 

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robj101
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natural wrote:The idea that

natural wrote:

The idea that 'spirituality' has a monopoly on our sense of wonder is bullshit. Wonder is an emotion that all humans can and do feel. There is no need to believe in anything supernatural to appreciate the wonders of the universe.

Check out some of my writings on the subject:

Taking a Step Beyond Awe

What is Wonderism?

Wonderism, Pragmatism, and Prediction

 

My real question was does a theist get this sense of awe or feeling of wonder about anything thats not "god" related ? I bet they do actually but they would likely attribute it to a "god". I of course had hoped a theist would answer.

Faith is the word but next to that snugged up closely "lie's" the want.
"By simple common sense I don't believe in god, in none."-Charlie Chaplin


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robj101 wrote:My real

robj101 wrote:

My real question was does a theist get this sense of awe or feeling of wonder about anything thats not "god" related ?

I was responding moreso to this question:

Quote:
I say shiver of discovery, I don't know what you call it when thet feeling comes over you that says you have hit on something.

It seems like you didn't have the words to describe the feeling, and I was trying to offer the idea that wonder itself is the correct word. You see, it has been far too long that people have claimed that these feelings are 'religious' or 'spiritual'. They aren't. They are just feelings of wonder and awe and sometimes terror. Sometimes we can call them "Ah ha" moments or a "Eureka" experience, but it's all just wonder. A sense of understanding and appreciation at the same time as a sense of incomplete understanding and the feeling of enormity or vastness. Metaphorically speaking, the Mountain and the Abyss.

Quote:
I bet they do actually but they would likely attribute it to a "god". I of course had hoped a theist would answer.

They wouldn't know how to answer. They don't understand the question! Of course they think these feelings are solely the domain of the religious/spiritual. That's the point I was trying to make. They do not know what to make of the idea that *anybody* can have these feelings, especially not atheists.

A major purpose of wonderism is to put forth the idea that not only can anybody feel a sense of wonder -- that the 'religious' feelings are not owned by the religious only --  but also that you can achieve a *greater* sense of wonder by understanding and experiencing the universe as it *really* is, as discovered through science and reason. The true story of the universe is by far and away a more compelling and beautiful story than any of the out-dated parables of any religious 'holy' book.

You are unlikely to get any coherent response from a theist because this idea is so far out of their basic assumptions that they will have a difficult time grasping that it could possibly be so. I predict the most common response you'll get will either be silence or head-in-the-sand denial.

This is a major reason why I think wonderism is a powerful antidote to theism. I've never seen a theist able to put up any sort of defense against the idea that their 'special' feelings are not special at all, that anyone can feel them, and they are just a natural part of the human experience. Their last defense, the Argument from Religious/Spiritual Experience is blown out of the water.

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robj101 wrote:We are

robj101 wrote:
We are supposed to be made in gods image, where are our flashy extra parts?
Our flashy and not so flashy extra parts are in other dimensions. The "God's image" is an occult statement which says, that humans have triple structure, which is similar the known triple structure of God. You know, God is said to come as 3-in-1 package, Father, Son and Holy spirit, Shiva, Vishnu and Brahma, Strong nuclear force, Gravity and Weak nuclear force (which splits up on more forces) or as we esotericists say, Will, Love-Wisdom and Active intelligence.
And human structure is said to be similar, physical person, wise and loving soul, and monad or so-called spirit at the highest point, which powers the whole thing. Such is basically the meaning of this occult statement. Just technical stuff.

natural wrote:

Quote:
I say shiver of discovery, I don't know what you call it when thet feeling comes over you that says you have hit on something.

It seems like you didn't have the words to describe the feeling, and I was trying to offer the idea that wonder itself is the correct word. You see, it has been far too long that people have claimed that these feelings are 'religious' or 'spiritual'. They aren't. They are just feelings of wonder and awe and sometimes terror. Sometimes we can call them "Ah ha" moments or a "Eureka" experience, but it's all just wonder. A sense of understanding and appreciation at the same time as a sense of incomplete understanding and the feeling of enormity or vastness. Metaphorically speaking, the Mountain and the Abyss.

Yeeeaaaahh..... I love that feeling. I experience it sometimes when I'm up to something new. Is that from transcendental source? Maybe is, but I'd never say that theists are better at it than anyone else. This is a basic working mode of geniuses. Geniuses are able to pull that trick off more often than a normal person and also are skillful enough to manifest the idea physically. To find out what it is, professional psychologists and neurologists must study genial people and must create new psychologic science, which will train the same abilities in common mortals. My esoteric study includes the principle of "science, concrete knowledge and logics" as one of basics of the universe and one of two most important factors of humanity. There are other types, like the religional, devoted type, which is typically theistic or even fanatic. But all these types have the same potential of contacting the divine principle in them. Whatever the transcendental principles are, they are so natural, that they're naturally present even in the most mundane things and people. Our confused definitions of what is or isn't "spiritual" have almost nothing to do with that.

natural wrote:
You are unlikely to get any coherent response from a theist because this idea is so far out of their basic assumptions that they will have a difficult time grasping that it could possibly be so. I predict the most common response you'll get will either be silence or head-in-the-sand denial.

This is a major reason why I think wonderism is a powerful antidote to theism. I've never seen a theist able to put up any sort of defense against the idea that their 'special' feelings are not special at all, that anyone can feel them, and they are just a natural part of the human experience. Their last defense, the Argument from Religious/Spiritual Experience is blown out of the water.

Well then, according to these descriptions I'm not really a theist. When it comes to wonder, theists are really weird! They get their fix on thousand times repeated nonsense. Let's take for example the story of Jesus. A theist will vividly replay in his mind the gluttonous feast of Last supper, the horror of Christ's arrest, the almost unimaginable über-martyric suffering on Golgotha and the wonderful, glorious and mysterious supernatural ressurrection on the third day. And he will do it every fucking year on Easter, like a stuck gramophone! Really, I can hardly understand how theists can live just with one book which they must know inside out. I'm almost willing to believe that theistic wonder is not a normal person's wonder but neither it is from god. It's an artificial thing, rails burrowed deep into grey matter, emotional buttons that work perfectly when pushed.

Hey Natural, have you ever tried an experiment? What would Jes...eh, theist do, when exposed to some really awesome science, fact, or new information? I mean, some reasonably educated theists who can comprehend the awesomeness. There's no point in trying that with Bible belt hicks.

Beings who deserve worship don't demand it. Beings who demand worship don't deserve it.


robj101
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I'm a non-believer bible

I'm a non-believer bible belt hick and I'm surrounded by believers. A new protestant church just opened up 2 blocks from where I work. Those people pretend to have that "feeling" but I'm convinced it is not any god but a simple feeling they would get from gathering together and acting like retards in a public place.

I imagine standing on a busy street corner and acting like a complete idiot, like pulling down your pants and taking a dump in front of everyone, yea you might get a queasy feeling from that though I don't know that it would be good or addictive feeling. I suppose you can't really liken that to a church experience though where everyone would be taking a dump, you would only be in competition to see who could take the biggest dump and those who had a more productive excrement release might get a bigger "feeling".

Faith is the word but next to that snugged up closely "lie's" the want.
"By simple common sense I don't believe in god, in none."-Charlie Chaplin