Immigration and idiots
Offline I'm past tired of seeing idiots typing small items such as "your short history you are all immigrants." blah blah.
Number one, do normal people comparatively speak of all immigrants in relation to illegal immigrants? This is disgustingly retarded. (I said the R word, oh noes)
Number 2, My parents were born here, their parents were born here, and their parents before them. Now, what generation in an idiots eyes will no longer be considered "immigrants". I'm tempted to throw illegal on the back of that because they seem to not know a difference.
Number 3, I happen to like Arizonas newest immigration law, I think it is a little late but all this insane political correctness has allowed it to become a problem in the first place. I would guess most here actually disagree with the new law but, I wish Texas would employ it. Ron Paul in 2012 !
Faith is the word but next to that snugged up closely "lie's" the want.
"By simple common sense I don't believe in god, in none."-Charlie Chaplin
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The internet doesn't encourage rational debate. Body language and facial expressions are a big part of our communication. And no, smileys help, but they don't compensate enough.
I think the rational political debate was given a kick in the head by Reagan and his 30 second sound bites. And it was further beaten down by Limbaugh, Gingrich and all the other yellers, no matter their views on either "side". When we start with "us against them", rationality has flown. (goes for you, Rob)
Have you found the papers on how debate or research just reinforces your current opinions?
-- I feel so much better since I stopped trying to believe.
"We are entitled to our own opinions. We're not entitled to our own facts"- Al Franken
"If death isn't sweet oblivion, I will be severely disappointed" - Ruth M.
#2. Good question. I don't really have an answer to it. Natives receive some great help for businesses, education, etc even if they have only a small fraction of actual native american blood. Also, in many countries (in many EU countries) the fact that you have been born in the country does not make you a citizen of that country. The US is rather an exception.
#3. Police can ask for WHAT? For a passport? Ok, what are they gonna look for in the passport? For a visa? Great, do the KNOW how a US visa looks like? Do they know that visa 1) does NOT prove your legal status 2) neither does it terminate your legal status after the visa's expiration date. OK, furthermore. There are several types of documents confirming your legal status in the US. Some of them ought to be in the passport, some of them might only be available through the USCIS.
So, my questions here are:
1) Do the police officers receive appropriate training in US immigration and naturalization laws and current DHS and USCIS policies?
2) Will the DHS share willingly information about regarding certain persons with local police officers? What is the officers request information out of business hours?
3) States have NO authority to deport anyone out of the US. Just NO WAY. How does this little legal issue is going to be settled?
4) If someone happened to be less proud than you would to carry the birth certificate ALL THE TIME, and moreove if someone simply did not care to get a copy of the birth certificate, does it mean he or she will be detained by police for several days before the birth certificate request proves the citizenship of the person?
Also, I do NOT carry my passport and visa documents with me. If I lose my driver license, it will take me maybe a few days to get a new one. If I lose my passport or say green card, it will take a few months and several hundreds of $$$ at best to get new documents. If people are required to carry their passports with them all the time, then there will be many more documents lost every day, which will a) make it easier to get a "found"/stolen document and 2) get arrested (indefinitely perhaps due to the lack of regulations and laws) for having no passport (if it is lost, you don't have it, so you are screwed completely).
I think that LEGAL visitors in Arizona who happened to lose some of their documents can start learning hara-kiri techniques.
There is a large native born population of educated, native born Hispanics in the northwest. Their parents and grandparents came up to pick cherries and apples. Other states are struggling, too.
I speak a little Spanish, I wouldn't call myself fluent. But my manicurist, who is Peruvian, giggled off and on for ten minutes when I told her I was a "bruja vieja" - old witch. I can say please and thank you in French. I can ask for a beer and where is the restroom in German and Italian as well as Spanish. Important phrases if you ever visit those countries. If I intended to visit another foreign county, I would be sure to learn those phrases in whatever language to the best of my ability. Ain't no skin off my nose to be polite and be sure I can get a beer.
Lots of "tiendas" around here. I don't shop in them because I can get all the ingredients I need at the local supermarket. Even fresh chili peppers. I cook Mexican dishes because that is what I grew up with - El Charro green chili enchiladas every payday. And since El Charro is not a chain, if I want them I have to cook my own. No one in the NW makes them like El Charro. We made rolled tacos (taquitos) and burritos at home when I was a child and when I had my own children. You can feed a lot of bottomless teenagers with burritos very inexpensively. And being from Yuma, my dishes are hot enough I only have one or two friends that can eat what I consider barely torchy.
<sarcasm> Let's go with the strawman arguments.</sarcasm> Who the heck suggested that?
Fortunately, most of my friends who grew up in Texas but now live in the NW don't have your attitude.
-- I feel so much better since I stopped trying to believe.
"We are entitled to our own opinions. We're not entitled to our own facts"- Al Franken
"If death isn't sweet oblivion, I will be severely disappointed" - Ruth M.
Many different ethnic groups (including Texans) like to have ethnic groceries. Usually someone there can speak domestic language (English in Texas). If you don't like such groceries, don't go there.
Though I do not support the idea of having sex with whole states, Texas is not the same as you, so f%$ng Texas is not the same as f@$%ng you.
These are very good and valid. Arizona is a closed record state. That means to get my birth certificate, I have to print the form from the internet, photocopy my driver's license, assert and aver that my married name is my legal name, and so on and so forth. As a contrast, in Washington state you can call on the phone, and they will look up and print your birth certificate, no supporting documentation required.
Oregon recently changed their law for driver's licenses. You have to have your old license and at least two supporting documents or your passport to renew. If you lose your license, you have to have more documents.
My dad was born in Oklahoma in 1925. He doesn't have a birth certificate. Birth certificates were not required in Oklahoma then and he was born on a farm. He left when he was 6, during the dust bowl. So he didn't attend school there. And he doesn't remember the name of the nearest town. I had a very pleasant person at the records office search the entire state from 1920-1930. No certificate. His family didn't attend church. No baptismal record. If he wanted a passport, the mess around with the papers would be a blizzard. No one is certain about his mother whether she was an immigrant or not, whether she had citizenship or not, though we all strongly suspect she had immigrated from Germany.
My point being that proving your citizenship isn't always easy.
-- I feel so much better since I stopped trying to believe.
"We are entitled to our own opinions. We're not entitled to our own facts"- Al Franken
"If death isn't sweet oblivion, I will be severely disappointed" - Ruth M.
You do realize that your attitude is the reason a lot of other countries hate us, right? An amazing amount of foreigners take the time to learn English in addition to their native language. The least you could do is show respect for their drive, and not get pissed when you need to specify you speak English. There are billions of people on this planet, and not all of them can talk to you. You don't think you should learn Spanish? Maybe you could take a hint and realize that if it is all around you, it is to your benefit to learn it. I live in Ohio, and I know Spanish. People like you amaze me.
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Ah, so you are a bleeding heart! Gotcha!
“A meritocratic society is one in which inequalities of wealth and social position solely reflect the unequal distribution of merit or skills amongst human beings, or are based upon factors beyond human control, for example luck or chance. Such a society is socially just because individuals are judged not by their gender, the colour of their skin or their religion, but according to their talents and willingness to work, or on what Martin Luther King called 'the content of their character'. By extension, social equality is unjust because it treats unequal individuals equally.” "Political Ideologies" by Andrew Heywood (2003)
I'm a realist.
I try to not downplay the ubar liberal here, why are you so willing to judge me? Politically correct in action, it's a fukin disease.
Faith is the word but next to that snugged up closely "lie's" the want.
"By simple common sense I don't believe in god, in none."-Charlie Chaplin
Absolutely. The Internet has many benefits, but one of the things I stress is how it creates micro-communities that reinforce dogmatic ideas (and no, the irony is not lost on me).
One of the reasons this specific debate annoys me is, honestly, I don't 'get' nationalism. All the outrage often falls flat to me, but it clearly forms a central pillar of the debate and that is tough for me to respect because I don't understand it. For example, when Rob talks about Spanish taking over I just want to shrug...so what if it does? I live in the grain basket of the Pacific NW though, so maybe I know too many Mexicans? They don't seem to be any worse than the white people I know. Maybe I'm a bad person because I don't tear up thinking about Old Glory in the hands of filthy brown people.
Everything makes more sense now that I've stopped believing.
It's über liberal because the word is a German word. It means "upward of" or "over". See, you do know a foreign language. The English slang has slipped it more towards the meaning of "over the top."
I am going to repeat myself a little here. The realist in the bunch is the one who realizes that the stupid law doesn't work. And it can't work. That is being realistic.
And if you want to go on about how I judge you, fine. Don't be such an easy target and you'll be harder for me to hit.
-- I feel so much better since I stopped trying to believe.
"We are entitled to our own opinions. We're not entitled to our own facts"- Al Franken
"If death isn't sweet oblivion, I will be severely disappointed" - Ruth M.
A moment of truth: the "right wing" of politics is more pragmatic than the left wing. No exceptions.
Case examples:Iwbiek and Vastet. (With Vastet being a bit of a "maybe" in some manner, but he doesn't strike me as "willing to meet half way"
Nutxaq??? What's the problem man? If a person wants to live in a country, they should learn the language and customs of said 'stretch of land'.
"ENGRISH HARD" is not an excuse to me.
“A meritocratic society is one in which inequalities of wealth and social position solely reflect the unequal distribution of merit or skills amongst human beings, or are based upon factors beyond human control, for example luck or chance. Such a society is socially just because individuals are judged not by their gender, the colour of their skin or their religion, but according to their talents and willingness to work, or on what Martin Luther King called 'the content of their character'. By extension, social equality is unjust because it treats unequal individuals equally.” "Political Ideologies" by Andrew Heywood (2003)
How many languages do you speak? One? Okaaaayyyyyy You have a lot of personal insight into learning foreign languages. </sarcasm> Don't leave a big target on your chest dummkopf.
-- I feel so much better since I stopped trying to believe.
"We are entitled to our own opinions. We're not entitled to our own facts"- Al Franken
"If death isn't sweet oblivion, I will be severely disappointed" - Ruth M.
up beyond all recognition liberal.
AKA FUBARL
“A meritocratic society is one in which inequalities of wealth and social position solely reflect the unequal distribution of merit or skills amongst human beings, or are based upon factors beyond human control, for example luck or chance. Such a society is socially just because individuals are judged not by their gender, the colour of their skin or their religion, but according to their talents and willingness to work, or on what Martin Luther King called 'the content of their character'. By extension, social equality is unjust because it treats unequal individuals equally.” "Political Ideologies" by Andrew Heywood (2003)
Written spanish is actually quite easy to learn, imo anyways!
Hablamos Espanol?
Or would you like another can of bugspray?
Hint: Safety labels.
“A meritocratic society is one in which inequalities of wealth and social position solely reflect the unequal distribution of merit or skills amongst human beings, or are based upon factors beyond human control, for example luck or chance. Such a society is socially just because individuals are judged not by their gender, the colour of their skin or their religion, but according to their talents and willingness to work, or on what Martin Luther King called 'the content of their character'. By extension, social equality is unjust because it treats unequal individuals equally.” "Political Ideologies" by Andrew Heywood (2003)
So what you are saying is the law does not work so, maybe just forget it and watch worlds collide? Pacifism ? Do you have a better idea?
Ubar is the way it is said in the gaming world and it seems to fit well enough.
Targeting, targeting... yea we are playing war.
Faith is the word but next to that snugged up closely "lie's" the want.
"By simple common sense I don't believe in god, in none."-Charlie Chaplin
Huh
Faith is the word but next to that snugged up closely "lie's" the want.
"By simple common sense I don't believe in god, in none."-Charlie Chaplin
She isn't even willing to use bug spray?
Punta nada utililus insecta ...................................... something?
“A meritocratic society is one in which inequalities of wealth and social position solely reflect the unequal distribution of merit or skills amongst human beings, or are based upon factors beyond human control, for example luck or chance. Such a society is socially just because individuals are judged not by their gender, the colour of their skin or their religion, but according to their talents and willingness to work, or on what Martin Luther King called 'the content of their character'. By extension, social equality is unjust because it treats unequal individuals equally.” "Political Ideologies" by Andrew Heywood (2003)
ubar liberal!=over liberal
ubar=fubar?
( I know you aren't that stupid, rob, so quit acting like it
)
“A meritocratic society is one in which inequalities of wealth and social position solely reflect the unequal distribution of merit or skills amongst human beings, or are based upon factors beyond human control, for example luck or chance. Such a society is socially just because individuals are judged not by their gender, the colour of their skin or their religion, but according to their talents and willingness to work, or on what Martin Luther King called 'the content of their character'. By extension, social equality is unjust because it treats unequal individuals equally.” "Political Ideologies" by Andrew Heywood (2003)
No, I'm saying think of something that will work and get behind that. Rule number one of a functioning law - the majority of people will obey it without coercion or oversight. You think most people follow the speed limit even occasionally because of the law? Nope, most of those old farts in hats follow the speed limit because they don't want to raise their insurance rates if they should happen to get a ticket.
Same with this law. If it does not address economic realities, if we can't think of a way to include those realities in the law, it is a waste of paper and resources. Sort of like the war on drugs. If I remember right, you sort of agree most drugs should be illegal. But you also agree that the war on drugs has not succeeded. Shall we have yet another law that is as useless and costly?
Don't go through life ignorant. Find out the antecedents. Learn the history. Don't leave yourself open for pot shots. Sheese, you are old enough to know better.
And like the old card game, it goes on forever.
-- I feel so much better since I stopped trying to believe.
"We are entitled to our own opinions. We're not entitled to our own facts"- Al Franken
"If death isn't sweet oblivion, I will be severely disappointed" - Ruth M.
In hind sight Europeans should have remained in Europe, resolved their own petty religious, national differences, become somewhat isolationist ( like China was for many centuries ) and allowed the other cultures of the world to rise or fall strictly upon their own merits. A policy of "you leave us alone and we'll leave you alone." Oops, too late for that ....would have been better for everyone involved, though.
How is this law going to be costly? All it is doing is granting police officers the OK to question. I haven't heard about them training a special task force that's going to go run down suspect illegals in big new vans or suv's. Why worry about cost anyway, the government plays like we have more money than we do, and if we need some more we have the bank of china. Of all the retarded spending why not use it for something that might possibly make a dent?
Btw, other countries don't hate us for our "attitude" they hate us because we go in and set their govt' up with welfare and rules to keep their people down. No competition allowed. That's why we have muslim terrorists and Rudy Juliani's in denial. Our foreign policy sucks ass.
I know where the term uber came from, I chose to use the slang and I'm sorry it upsets you. In gaming terms ubar means "super elite" pretty much. Something tells me you would be one of the few to not pick up on it and well you shouldn't I suppose.
Faith is the word but next to that snugged up closely "lie's" the want.
"By simple common sense I don't believe in god, in none."-Charlie Chaplin
it wasn't a question, it was a passing, "huh"
Faith is the word but next to that snugged up closely "lie's" the want.
"By simple common sense I don't believe in god, in none."-Charlie Chaplin
Unfortunately, the US foreign policy is a direct consequence of the attitude of Americans toward foreigners, foreign countries, and foreign countries' governments.
Also, your attitude towards Latino people and Spanish language reinforces the hate moods of Mexicans regarding the US.
BTW, a few months ago I've heard Limbaugh (if I remember correctly) took on French and French speaking Canadians. The sentence was approximately like this: "French nationalists, you must stop hiding from reality and learn the universal language of the world which is English". Well, if I were French, I would certainly enjoy to demonstrate Mr. L my middle finger ... and if I would hear that MILLIONS of Americans support him, I would tend to make a generalization about the entire US population.
If you are proud of your language (flag, etc.), do not assume that everyone else must share your values to the point of abandoning his owns .... or else.
BTW, America has been discovered by non-English speakers. I've just found on Wikipedia what Columbus wrote about Bahamian natives
"Many of the men I have seen have scars on their bodies, and when I made signs to them to find out how this happened, they indicated that people from other nearby islands come to San Salvador to capture them; they defend themselves the best they can. I believe that people from the mainland come here to take them as slaves. They ought to make good and skilled servants, for they repeat very quickly whatever we say to them. I think they can very easily be made Christians, for they seem to have no religion. If it pleases our Lord, I will take six of them to Your Highnesses when I depart, in order that they may learn our language."
Now I see that the views of many US citizens are exactly the same as those of people 500 years ago!
I only wish I could view the world with the same childlike wonder in such an optomistic light.
How bout we immigrate to pakistan, see you know, if they will start speaking english and start using our customs. Yea Mexico too, we could just walk in and play like it's ours. Just pick a country, see how they enjoy people from any other country waltzing in and culturally annihilating their society, culture and way of life.
If I decide to move to another country, I will attempt to learn the language and customs, you know, to get along and become a part of that society. Considering I want to move there, it must mean I like it. If I try to move in with my language, my customs, I will be realistic enough to understand that it may not be accepted and I will probably have a hard time, in some places I might be killed. dur
edit: oh and they are going to bring back 6 people and make them learn the language. Yea it would probably be better for the entire country to learn the language of the 6 individuals huh, lol thats a silly one too.
Faith is the word but next to that snugged up closely "lie's" the want.
"By simple common sense I don't believe in god, in none."-Charlie Chaplin
Annihilating society? Can you give an example of what you are talking about please?
If you move to another country (especially to the country that language is different from your language) you will almost unavoidably seek contacts with people like you. People of your country's diaspora will speak your language. If the diaspora is big, there will be local grocery stores where almost everyone speaks your language. If you want, you will have an option to speak your language exclusively and learn no foreign language.
Mexican immigrants might be quite scared by English-speaking people's attitude to Mexican-looking people speaking with thick accent (which is definitely intended to "annihilate American culture"
. Because of this attitude they may very well choose to contain themselves within their diaspora and speak English as little as possible.
Please understand that we aren't all like that...
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Every stinking law on the books costs money. In time, in training for the officers, in court time, in lawyer time, time, time, time. Who is paying at the moment is the Arizona tax payer. And the state of AZ does not have the ability to print cash when they need it. Same for Texas, New Mexico and California. Any laws they enact similar to this one will cost the state tax payers. And it sure don't look like the feds are going to cover their ass as the feds are pissed about the law. Come on, Rob, where is your head?
Recall the post about training for being able to read a damn passport + visa. Would you recognize it if you saw it? Would you know if it was valid or not? Why do you think your local county mounty would recognize it? Training = time that could be spent chasing down dangerous criminals - hispanic or black or white. You know, robbers, murderers, rapists, drug abusers.
Court time - the courts are over loaded now, with long waits for access. You want to sue someone and how long does it take to get in? Look it up for Texas. What the heck are the officers going to do once they have determined someone is illegal? Put them in a cell - which could have been used for a dangerous criminal. Then a court appearance is scheduled. They damn sure ain't putting them in the old black and white and driving them to Mexico. Kind of a long trip from most of the state and that would also cost money.
Someone will have to pay a lawyer who speaks Spanish to represent them. Probably the tax payers again. Under the US Constitution, they have a right to a lawyer and the Supreme Court has ruled they have a right to understand their lawyer. I don't give a rat's ass if you don't like them having a lawyer who speaks Spanish paid for with AZ tax dollars. That is the law. And we are talking about obeying the law?
I've thought our foreign policy sucks for years - probably longer than you have been born. I finally figured out it does me no good to fret about it. They are going to do what they damn well please and nobody, not a single person, has ever asked me for my opinion on the US foreign policy. So I do my best to vote for people who sound like pacifists and hope they aren't really as stupid as the hawks. So far, it hasn't worked. I'm guessing you would vote for hawks if you thought about and I will bet you it wouldn't make a damn bit of difference.
I don't do the same gaming as you do - I know that puts me out in the old fuddy duddy arena. And I was mostly twitting you on your attitude of not learning another foreign language. You "should" know a hell of a lot of English words have foreign origins. And you "should" know that you speak these foreign words every day. Mouthing off about learning Spanish when you already know a lot of words is just juvenile. And I know you know a bunch no matter what you say. You can't live where you do without picking some up. Want to bet if I start calling you some of the names I learned on the playground in grade school that you wouldn't recognize the words?
-- I feel so much better since I stopped trying to believe.
"We are entitled to our own opinions. We're not entitled to our own facts"- Al Franken
"If death isn't sweet oblivion, I will be severely disappointed" - Ruth M.
Indeed I would also like to add the US has no official language at the federal level. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Languages_of_the_United_States
I was going to respond but I digress live in your dream world.
I do have one question though, why are you speaking english?
Faith is the word but next to that snugged up closely "lie's" the want.
"By simple common sense I don't believe in god, in none."-Charlie Chaplin
1: Government toilet seats cost upwards of $20,000. I'm well aware that everything costs. The "cost" of this law is minimal compared to many others. To cut costs should we just have NO laws? Again, have you a better proposal? We HAVE deported many many over the last few years, upwards of 500,000.
2: Foreign policy is not dictated by the public, it is set by public officials whom for the most part have been elected by said public. Maybe I'm all alone in the knowledge that these public officials are for the most part corrupt assholes and our little 2 party system sucks ass. Trying to choose the lesser of two evils is a terrible system but we put up with it so it must be ok because a revolution is unrealistis and just plain stupid.
3: If you wish to think I have no grasp on the english language and have no idea about the words we use from other languages etc. you are welcome to do so.
If you want to know more, type in multiculturalism problems on youtube.
My sarcastic mind says in 40 years it will be muslim vs catholic here in the US, yea most mexicans are catholic. Because we have so many open minded loving people, we will become more multicultural and then what, everyone is going to hold hands and get along? How happy will you be when another culture comes in and forces you to do things their way? Look at Britain, France and Spain, we are a little behind but we will catch up!
Faith is the word but next to that snugged up closely "lie's" the want.
"By simple common sense I don't believe in god, in none."-Charlie Chaplin
This is because my work involves a lot of reading and communication in English.
Annihilation of a culture ? Perhaps. How many meso-americans born in Mexico can speak the native languages of their ancestors ? Except for isolated enclaves these native languages are all but dead. The rest all speak Spanish, which is a European language.
How many continue to practice their native, ancestral religions ? ( A handful ? ) Catholicism, brought over by European missionaries, is the unrivaled religious juggernaut of that nation.
How many of these meso-americans are now actually "mestizos" due to the physical intermingling of the original inhabitants with their European ( Spanish ) interlopers ? ( Ironically, so-called Mexicans who frequently decry their own ethnic victimization have traditionally been a part of a culture that maintained their own racial caste system regarding the oppression and discrimination against the Indian indigenisimo. http://flagblackened.net/revolt/mexico.html )
Briefly, if I remember correctly 100percentAtheist you are from Russia ? Ironically, a nation that takes its name from the Rus, ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rus' ) a group of Swedish Vikings who migrated to that already populated region and then over time became the dominant culture ? Am I correct regarding that history ?
So why not ask them to use your own language?
Faith is the word but next to that snugged up closely "lie's" the want.
"By simple common sense I don't believe in god, in none."-Charlie Chaplin
yea he chose to ignore the cultural relevance I associated with it.
Faith is the word but next to that snugged up closely "lie's" the want.
"By simple common sense I don't believe in god, in none."-Charlie Chaplin
and because of "Russian Reversal"
"In Communist World, money capitalize YOU!"
Re:100% atheist
“A meritocratic society is one in which inequalities of wealth and social position solely reflect the unequal distribution of merit or skills amongst human beings, or are based upon factors beyond human control, for example luck or chance. Such a society is socially just because individuals are judged not by their gender, the colour of their skin or their religion, but according to their talents and willingness to work, or on what Martin Luther King called 'the content of their character'. By extension, social equality is unjust because it treats unequal individuals equally.” "Political Ideologies" by Andrew Heywood (2003)
I've already heard of this before. Sure, it's true. No, I still don't care what liberals have accomplished at federal levels.
ed note: ON wiki, even...
“A meritocratic society is one in which inequalities of wealth and social position solely reflect the unequal distribution of merit or skills amongst human beings, or are based upon factors beyond human control, for example luck or chance. Such a society is socially just because individuals are judged not by their gender, the colour of their skin or their religion, but according to their talents and willingness to work, or on what Martin Luther King called 'the content of their character'. By extension, social equality is unjust because it treats unequal individuals equally.” "Political Ideologies" by Andrew Heywood (2003)
To cut costs we should have realistic laws that most people will voluntarily follow because it is in their self-interest to do so. The better proposal was Cpt. Pineapple's post. Who, btw, is a lot more to the right than I am on most topics. Streamline the visa process for manual labor jobs and get the workers legal. Mind, we are not talking giving them citizenship on a platter. Just the ability to work legally. This is similar to the existing H1-B visas for tech workers. It should not be that hard to do.
If you think you can get a third party off the ground, have fun. On the Oregon ballot there are 1-6 parties on the ballot depending on the elective position. Gets to be a real drag trying to figure out if it is worth voting for any of the clowns. And it is still most often Dem and Reps that are elected. A lot of inertia out there but knock yourself out.
It ain't me who is mouthing off about never learning a word of Spanish. If you don't want me to get after you, don't be a dick.
As for multiculturalism. Shall we discuss what has happened so far in US history? Is New York the same cultural city it was when the Dutch founded it as New Amsterdam? Do you celebrate British customs or the German ones of the more recent immigrants to Texas? You forget I'm in IT - change happens so quickly in IT that if you are uncomfortable with change you really should get in another line of work. Yeah, things will change. Shit, things have changed since I was a child. And most likely customs and attitudes will change more than once before I die. Will it be Muslims vs Catholics? Who the fuck knows and who cares? You deal with the hand you have been dealt and get on with your life.
The problem I see with people who want everything to stay the same forever is that they are living in fantasy land. You haven't changed my mind, Rob.
-- I feel so much better since I stopped trying to believe.
"We are entitled to our own opinions. We're not entitled to our own facts"- Al Franken
"If death isn't sweet oblivion, I will be severely disappointed" - Ruth M.
There are theories, according to which Vikings migrated from what is now South Russia to Norway.
BTW, which ethnos are you talking about, slavic, ancient Russians, or modern Russians?
Because it is MY choice, no one forced me to learn English.
If Spanish will be the major spoken language in the US ... so be it. I do not see any problem with this. If you speak English only, it's fine, stay around your English speaking friends, open your ethnic English groceries. If you don't like it, go back to your England.
Is this why Chinese is now so popular in schools?
Is this what you want to say?
Money 'capitalizes' the 'workers' just as much, if not more, in the US.
Its not so much the official ideology of the country, it is powerful organizations that do that, whether government or big private corporations.
Favorite oxymorons: Gospel Truth, Rational Supernaturalist, Business Ethics, Christian Morality
"Theology is now little more than a branch of human ignorance. Indeed, it is ignorance with wings." - Sam Harris
The path to Truth lies via careful study of reality, not the dreams of our fallible minds - me
From the sublime to the ridiculous: Science -> Philosophy -> Theology
HEY!
I resent that "stereotype" - my psychiatrist.... WAS Chinese.
“A meritocratic society is one in which inequalities of wealth and social position solely reflect the unequal distribution of merit or skills amongst human beings, or are based upon factors beyond human control, for example luck or chance. Such a society is socially just because individuals are judged not by their gender, the colour of their skin or their religion, but according to their talents and willingness to work, or on what Martin Luther King called 'the content of their character'. By extension, social equality is unjust because it treats unequal individuals equally.” "Political Ideologies" by Andrew Heywood (2003)
“A meritocratic society is one in which inequalities of wealth and social position solely reflect the unequal distribution of merit or skills amongst human beings, or are based upon factors beyond human control, for example luck or chance. Such a society is socially just because individuals are judged not by their gender, the colour of their skin or their religion, but according to their talents and willingness to work, or on what Martin Luther King called 'the content of their character'. By extension, social equality is unjust because it treats unequal individuals equally.” "Political Ideologies" by Andrew Heywood (2003)
I'm not trying to change your mind.
When did I say I didn't know a word of spanish. I actually know enough to get by when I get a customer who does not speak english, which is several times a day usually.
I never said I wanted anything to stay the same either, you are making several inferences here. I think a lot of things could change and make it a better place, however I think the country is headed south overall at this time.
Faith is the word but next to that snugged up closely "lie's" the want.
"By simple common sense I don't believe in god, in none."-Charlie Chaplin
So why did you make such a choice, you could simply insist that everyone else learn your language. This is what you are telling me, why didn't you just seek out people who spoke your language and used your customs? No? Instead you learned the language and are obviously learning the customs. Why?
This is sad because you seem like a good example of an excellent immigrant which I have absolutely no problem with.
If I wanted to be in Mexico I would move there, as far as I'm concerned they can keep it there. If it is better here and they like it so much why try to turn it into what they are leaving. Oh yea, wal-mart's.
I didn't come from England, I have been there once, on a stopover but I really didn't get to look around much. It is a foreign country to me, foreign laws,customs etc. You speak as if I myself immigrated from england, this is silly as hell
Faith is the word but next to that snugged up closely "lie's" the want.
"By simple common sense I don't believe in god, in none."-Charlie Chaplin
You said you didn't want to learn Spanish and did not like having to speak to your customers in Spanish. Which attitude probably leaks into your conversations with your customers. And I realize you don't care.
You don't want the US to be run over with Muslims and Catholics, but that doesn't mean you don't want change? How can the US be run over with Muslims and Catholics and not change? It's a real disconnect for me. Oh, you want other changes. Let me guess.......as long as the changes are what you personally want, it's okay.
I have heard people whiz and moan about how the US is going to hell in a hand basket for as long as I can remember. My grandparents, parents, and other relations were all certain the US was over. Now my sister, brother, and cousins and have joined in. My sons know better than to start. LOL Growing up, my family were small business owners. Guess what. They were going to go out of business any day. Guess what else. The cousins have a website now and the business has expanded and it looks to be doing really well. But if you talk to them -- oh, business is terrible.
Farmers. Farmers are the worse. I have lived in farm country and if the weather is bad, they won't have enough crops to sell to take advantage of the high prices (since every other farmer's crops are not doing well, either). If the weather is great, prices are in the toilet and they will let the crop rot rather than take the lower price. Hey, I have no problem with them doing just that, but why gripe about it? It is the same thing they did the last time. And the time before. And if it is so stinking bad, sell the business, sell the farm. Otherwise, STFU.
Have you been following this guy? http://thisistheendoftheworldasweknowit.com/ I haven't.
TITEOTWAWKI - say it out loud. Emphasis the last two syllables - WAWKI - wacky. You got it.
I can just imagine you at my age. Still whizzing and moaning about the US sinking in to a morass of - well, whatever is the big to do when you get to be not yet 60. What a drag.
Look, I'm not hiding my head in the sand. I'm not ignoring the problems. But we are back to reality. Reality is I can't change or fix all the problems. I can't change a significant portion of them. I can influence a few and I do what I can when I can. If what I can do isn't good enough, then it isn't. Whizzing about how powerless I am and how I don't like it is a waste of time and energy and it's damn depressing. So I don't.
-- I feel so much better since I stopped trying to believe.
"We are entitled to our own opinions. We're not entitled to our own facts"- Al Franken
"If death isn't sweet oblivion, I will be severely disappointed" - Ruth M.
Hmm, I'm am still reading but there appear a fair number of disparate ethnic groups in association with each other and vying for dominance. ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Early_East_Slavs ) From what I understand there was most certainly a Scandanavian presence in the mix ( the Varangians http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Varangians ) who would most certainly qualify as foreigners / immigrants. The Varangians associated / competed with the native Slavs and eventually established preeminence. The major influence of invaders of Swedish origin seems to be hardly contested.
Since we are discussing the history of your homeland, I'm wondering what your view is on this "immigration" . Is it even a topic that is discussed academically in modern Russia ?
But where did the Swedes come from?
We know we all ultimately come from Africa, and would most likely have all have come from or through Central Asia, apart from a few who may have crossed the Mediterranean in early water-craft.
So it is unlikely that there was no-one in the are already when they came back from Scandinavia. To what is now Russia.
Favorite oxymorons: Gospel Truth, Rational Supernaturalist, Business Ethics, Christian Morality
"Theology is now little more than a branch of human ignorance. Indeed, it is ignorance with wings." - Sam Harris
The path to Truth lies via careful study of reality, not the dreams of our fallible minds - me
From the sublime to the ridiculous: Science -> Philosophy -> Theology
Yes, I was only referring to the time in human development where patterns of genetic diversity/ adaptation had already manifested itself among the human species. I am not contesting common origin.
I hope that I am only reflecting the opinions of historical /archeological examination on the subject. I do not claim to speak with authority on this issue. So far there seems to be evidence of a foreign invasion by ethnic Scandinavians who eventually rose to displace their native competition.
This phenomena certainly existed throughout history did it not ? ...one group coming in and pushing out / absorbing another ?