"I'm going to pray for you."

Inferno
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"I'm going to pray for you."

How do any of you react to someone saying that at the end of a conversation? I had a debate with a theist yesterday over the idea of absolute/objective morality vs. relative morality and at the end he said that he would pray for me as an abrupt end to the conversation. Is it a cop out because they really have no valid response to your points or is it a subtle way of saying screw you?

 

And do any of you have any good responses to it that would entail the same message in a non-religious package? I was thinking something along the lines of "I hope you come to your senses as well."


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"I'll think for you"It's a

"I'll think for you"

It's a classic. Or...

"That's nice. Will you also sacrifice a goat?"

Or...

"I'd rather you do something productive with your time"


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Inferno wrote:How do any of

Inferno wrote:

How do any of you react to someone saying that at the end of a conversation? I had a debate with a theist yesterday over the idea of absolute/objective morality vs. relative morality and at the end he said that he would pray for me as an abrupt end to the conversation. Is it a cop out because they really have no valid response to your points or is it a subtle way of saying screw you?

 

Yes, it is a cop out and a screw you all in one neat package.

 

Inferno wrote:

And do any of you have any good responses to it that would entail the same message in a non-religious package? I was thinking something along the lines of "I hope you come to your senses as well."

 

I think that is too polite.  Maybe it is better that you are more polite than they are, but it is still very polite response when someone has just said screw you.

That said, I really don't have a great come back, either.  I usually say something along the lines of -- "Don't bother, it's just a waste of your time.  How about praying for the thousands of children who are starved, beaten, raped and/or murdered every day?"

-- I feel so much better since I stopped trying to believe.

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Well, I have a christian

Well, I have a christian scientist who frequently wants to pray for the torn cartilage in my knee. Mind you, it is white cartilage that is torn, so it ain't ever gonna heal.

 

Now I suppose that I could ask him to do something more productive with his time but that would probably mean that he would just find someone else to pray for. So when he starts with me, I just tell him that if it helps him, that is fine but it will have no effect on me.

 

I do like the idea of sacrificing a goat though.

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How about"Don't worry

How about

"Don't worry talking to yourself doesn't necessarily mean that you're crazy."


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If they just say it as

If they just say it as well-wishing I just say thank you.  If they say it in a debate about theism I'd be snarky.

 

Everything makes more sense now that I've stopped believing.


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My usual response is an

My usual response is an apathetic, yet highly vindictive "..."

However, when I really want to tell religious people off, I go straight for the "Pray all you want to; I'm sure you'll feel better for it!"

To tell religious people "FU!"... you have to be indirect. You have to master what Romans would have called "Rhetoric", and you have to use their own words; their own scripture(!!!); against them.

When they realize they're being toyed around like with a cat that has a new rodent to torture and claw to death, they metaphorically throw their arms up and say "FARK THIS BULLSHIT!"

In a sense, sometimes it really pays off to "be a snake", and wait for theists to make a mistake in conversation.

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Let them pray for you. Tell

Let them pray for you. Tell them you appreciate their concern and support.

Be sure to follow-up and let them know that you are still suffering, still have the problem/issue/sickness. Suggest that they try harder. Follow up again, let them know you are still in such dire straits that you don't know what to do ~ perhaps they can get their churches congregation to pray for you. OH the horror when you follow up again and let them know you STILL suffer... Pull them close and ask them  what they are doing wrong? WHY isn't it working!!!???? Ask them how often praying has  helped them or their loved ones in the past... ask for them to get more people involved...maybe their prayer group, their neighbors...?

It really is fun to watch people spin their wheels.   :->

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http://obsidianwords.wordpress.com/


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Renee Obsidianwords

Renee Obsidianwords wrote:

Let them pray for you. Tell them you appreciate their concern and support.

Be sure to follow-up and let them know that you are still suffering, still have the problem/issue/sickness. Suggest that they try harder. Follow up again, let them know you are still in such dire straits that you don't know what to do ~ perhaps they can get their churches congregation to pray for you. OH the horror when you follow up again and let them know you STILL suffer... Pull them close and ask them  what they are doing wrong? WHY isn't it working!!!???? Ask them how often praying has  helped them or their loved ones in the past... ask for them to get more people involved...maybe their prayer group, their neighbors...?

It really is fun to watch people spin their wheels.   :->

 

You have a devious streak that I was not aware of.  I approve.

Everything makes more sense now that I've stopped believing.


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Renee Obsidianwords

Renee Obsidianwords wrote:

Let them pray for you. Tell them you appreciate their concern and support.

Be sure to follow-up and let them know that you are still suffering, still have the problem/issue/sickness. Suggest that they try harder. Follow up again, let them know you are still in such dire straits that you don't know what to do ~ perhaps they can get their churches congregation to pray for you. OH the horror when you follow up again and let them know you STILL suffer... Pull them close and ask them  what they are doing wrong? WHY isn't it working!!!???? Ask them how often praying has  helped them or their loved ones in the past... ask for them to get more people involved...maybe their prayer group, their neighbors...?

It really is fun to watch people spin their wheels.   :->

I don't understand why the Christians I meet find it so confusing that I care about the fact that they are wasting huge amounts of time and resources playing with their imaginary friend. Even non-confrontational religion hurts atheists because we live in a society which is constantly wasting resources and rejecting rational thinking.


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Whatthedeuce wrote:

Whatthedeuce wrote:

"haha, you very funny man!"


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I usually respond "...And I

I usually respond "...And I am going to dedicate my next dump, to you..."

 

unless they are old... then I just smile and hope I am in their will


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I usually just ignore

I usually just ignore them.  If I am not in a good mood, then I'll tell them "Please don't."  I prefer to avoid confrontations whenever possible, and the best way to do that is to ignore such crap.

Another thing that annoys me is when people say "God bless you!" or even just "Bless you!"  It is especially annoying when people do that after I sneeze.  Sometimes I'll even hold in a sneeze in order to avoid having people say this.  Even worse are the idiots who say "Bless you!" after every single sneeze when I am having a sneezing fit and sneeze multiple times in a row.  I mean, once is more than enough, so please shut up!  I used to always say a quiet "thank you" but now I just ignore people who say any form of this silly phrase to me.  Also, my mom usually says "I love you and God bless you!" at the end of every telephone conversation she has with me.  I only reply "I love you too" and ignore the other part.


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Well, when someone tries to

Well, when someone tries to bless me after a sneeze, I just say “Thank you very much. However, I don't ascribe to the doctrine of transmigration”. I have been doing that for years and it is an instant fuck you to whomever does the job.

 

One day, I hope that I can do that to a real theologian. Such people will know that they have just bee flipped off.

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Answers in Gene Simmons

Answers in Gene Simmons wrote:

Well, when someone tries to bless me after a sneeze, I just say “Thank you very much. However, I don't ascribe to the doctrine of transmigration”. I have been doing that for years and it is an instant fuck you to whomever does the job.

 

One day, I hope that I can do that to a real theologian. Such people will know that they have just bee flipped off.

 

 

How do you feel about "Gesundheit"?  Just out of curiosity.

-- I feel so much better since I stopped trying to believe.

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"I'm going to pray for

"I'm going to pray for you."

 

That translates into

"Fuck you, go burn in hell, but at least I asked God to save you so I can feel morally superior".

 

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I treat everyone fairly the

I treat everyone fairly the first time they say it to me, just like "bless you". I tell them it is not my thing and offer them something else to say to me to offer polite concern for my well being. After that it becomes annoying. It would be like inviting a Jew over for dinner and serving pork chops. Or just like when my mom kept trying to, over the years trying to get me to eat things I didn't like by saying, "You haven't had it this way".

If prayer works for people on the other side of the globe that you have never met, why would telling someone you know face to face be required, you CAN do it without telling someone. When you do tell them ESPECIALLY OVER AND OVER, all you are doing is selfishly saying, "look at me, I care about you".

It is fine to care about people you disagree with on any given subject, but it is rude to harass someone in order to merely advertise your club. Just do it if that is what you feel, but there is no need to tell the person after they tell you it is not there thing.

I DO NOT however, flip out if those offers of concern are said to others in my presence. I just prefer you say something else to me personally.

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Mahaco wrote:Another thing

Mahaco wrote:

Another thing that annoys me is when people say "God bless you!" or even just "Bless you!"  It is especially annoying when people do that after I sneeze.  Sometimes I'll even hold in a sneeze in order to avoid having people say this.  Even worse are the idiots who say "Bless you!" after every single sneeze when I am having a sneezing fit and sneeze multiple times in a row.  I mean, once is more than enough, so please shut up!  I used to always say a quiet "thank you" but now I just ignore people who say any form of this silly phrase to me.

 

When people do this (at least where I live) they are just conforming to social convention. They don't really mean to make a religious statement.

I don't understand why the Christians I meet find it so confusing that I care about the fact that they are wasting huge amounts of time and resources playing with their imaginary friend. Even non-confrontational religion hurts atheists because we live in a society which is constantly wasting resources and rejecting rational thinking.


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.

Inferno wrote:

How do any of you react to someone saying that at the end of a conversation?

 

The simplest response you, No you won't. The second should he protest he did you simply respond, No you didn't. The final answer to all if it is, If you had prayed we would not be having the conversation. Why? Because if you had prayed it would have worked.

For those amenable to logic, prayer either works or it does not. Given the absense of result it is not possible to distinguish between praying and not praying. But for the praying type continuing the exchange showing prayers do not work because the exchange continues leaves the problem with them to formulate. It may or may not be in your nature to suggest trying a different prayer or a different god. Dionysius is always a good choice.

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Depends on context really.

Depends on context really. If one of my religiously inclined friends offers to pray for me, perhaps if I've been telling them about some problem I've been having, I might rather they did something actually helpful but at least I'd appreciate the gesture of solidarity.

If a doorstep evangelist or someone of that ilk offers to pray for me rather than actually answer a question, I usually point that out and ask if they're actually praying for me, or praying for me to be less awkward next time.

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If prayer worked I wouldn't

If prayer worked I wouldn't have to mow my lawn.

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I agree

Brian37 wrote:

If prayer worked I wouldn't have to mow my lawn.

 

I've spent time praying to the master of earth and the prince of darkness Satan, lately, requesting the sort of debauched and sexed-up lifestyle the bible tells us we all have. And what a powerless fuck satan turned out to be. No bloody reply. Not even the appearance of a Bras'n'Things catalogue in the slot of my yearning mailbox. 

Magic, people. It's total bullshit.

 

 

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 I like, "I hope you come

 I like, "I hope you come to your senses, too."

 

Based on my own experience growing up in a religious family and suffering their religious friends and various churchlings, I really don't get the impression they are indirectly saying, "Fuck you" after a conversation/debate when they say this. They genuinely believe that I am wrong, have been misguided (possibly by the crafty work of satan), am just going through a dangerous phase, have been hanging out with "the wrong people", etc.

 

The fact is that they didn't pay much attention to anything I just said in the conversation, because they didn't view it the same way they would a conversation about whether or not aliens exist. For them, it was more like a conversation where they found out I was abusing drugs, and they were interrogating me about it, but not because they were interested in the perspectives of a drug abuser and considering whether it might be in their best interest to explore drug abuse as a possible life choice, but they were only interested in the sense that they were searching for an angle to make their pitch from. They were only interested in "talking sense to me", but they have to know more about my situation before they know which canned sermon they want to offer up in their attempt to win me back from the darkside. My explanations for why I believe the things I do don't matter to them, just like they don't care why a meth addicted relative thinks he needs his fix so much. All that matters is they need to save you. Explanations? Reasoning? Meh.

 

It's offensive, of course, but only because your perspective on atheism, to them, has no more value than a meth addict's on meth. Which is to say they don't believe you HAVE a perspective. They believe you have a symptom.

 

It's pure ignorance, like most of the offensive things they say and do without realizing it.

 

"I hope you come to your senses, too" seems like a much more fitting tit for tat.

 

A place common to all will be maintained by none. A religion common to all is perhaps not much different.


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 That wouldn't work bc then

 That wouldn't work bc then the xtian would just respond with something like, " well you need to open your heart" or something like that. When you are preaching make believe you can never lose. 

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