Avatar the movie

smartypants
Superfan
smartypants's picture
Posts: 597
Joined: 2009-03-20
User is offlineOffline
Avatar the movie

I saw Avatar opening night and was completely blown away. I highly recommend it.

I thought you folks might find this editorial interesting, as I did, because it discusses somewhat briefly some of the things I see going around in these forums:

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/12/21/opinion/21douthat1.html?th&emc=th

Ryan


Atheistextremist
atheist
Atheistextremist's picture
Posts: 5134
Joined: 2009-09-17
User is offlineOffline
Biological tech is coming

Vastet wrote:
Anti-tech my left testicle. The Na'vi tech was simply biological. Protecting THEIR environment was the PRESERVATION OF THEIR CULTURE AND COLLECTIVE KNOWLEDGE. Drawing a comparison between their environment and ours is too stupid to classify as stupid, for fear of insulting stupid people. The next time you can plug yourself into a tree and hear your ancestors speak is the time you can compare our environment to theirs. They even said as much in the film! "It's just a bunch of trees!" Ugh, no, it isn't.

 

Biological Computers -Can They Sidestep the Laws of Physics?

070521140917 In recent years Moore's Law, the idea the computing power will double every eighteen months, has seem less an amazing sign of progress and more an immense brick wall we're speeding towards - with recent advances like one-atom transistors, there simply isn't much further to go.  This has driven research in other directions that wouldn't have appealed back when regular chips could just get better and better.  3D chips, optical computing, quantum systems and even biological computers.

If the thought of doing complex mathematical problems makes you sick to your stomach, you might be able to help the solve the equations after all.  Scientists from Davidson College and Missouri Western State University have reprogrammed E. Coli bacteria, normally found doing their own thing in your stomach, to solve a mathematical problem in a cunning sidestep from classical computing - giving a whole new dimension to the term 'gut feeling'.

You like your brain?  Yeah, evolution can come up with some pretty damn fine results when it wants to.  The idea of a bacterial computer puts the evolutionary process to work solving mathematical problems. The terms of the problem are encoded in the genetic sequence of some harmless E. Coli bacteria (only a small minority of E. Coli cause all food the poisoning you hear about). They're also equipped with an antibiotic-resistance gene, but that gene is set only to activate when the genetic sequence is in the correct order - that is, when the problem is solved.  So when you place millions of these bacteria in a weak antibiotic solution solving the problem becomes a battle for survival.

Not that you'll ever be able to upgrade your hardware just by horking your stomach contents into it.  These bacterial computers are a fundamentally different system to silicon transistor number-crunchers, and can never match the latter's instruction execution rate.  Rather they would excel in problems where we don't have a clue what instructions to give, complex problems we don't know the best way to calculate can be evolved to an answer instead.

 

 

 

I love the idea of biological computers.

 

 

"Experiments are the only means of knowledge at our disposal. The rest is poetry, imagination." Max Planck


Cpt_pineapple
atheist
Posts: 5492
Joined: 2007-04-12
User is offlineOffline
Actually I noticed lots of

Actually I noticed lots of religious themes in the movie, mostly Panentheistic themes such as "Energy is borrowed from the spirits" or something of that effect, also the spirit tree and the way they view life/death were give aways.

 

 

 

 


Gauche
atheist
Gauche's picture
Posts: 1565
Joined: 2007-01-18
User is offlineOffline
Deadly Fingergun

Deadly Fingergun wrote:

Gauche wrote:
I'm freaking out so much I said you can believe whatever the hell you want. You seem to be doing plenty of denying, and disagreeing with lots of people. Perhaps if you do it loud enough the provincial hicks at the L.A. Times will retract the story. Maybe those rubes at the New Yorker will catch on as well. The New York Times may follow suit, probably not though. 

Argument from authority. You're boring now.

That's not an appeal to authority bozo. Ad verecundiam  occurs when citing someone who is not an expert, not disinterested, unrepresentative of expert opinion or unnecessarily cited.

http://www.fallacyfiles.org/authorit.html
http://logic.guruconsulting.org/tag/defective-induction/
http://freethoughtpedia.com/wiki/Logical_Fallacies_by_Todangst#Appeal_to_False_Authority

Beyond that it's suggesting something is true because an expert says so, not simply pointing out that no one shares your vapid opinion, except maybe Vastet.

There are twists of time and space, of vision and reality, which only a dreamer can divine
H.P. Lovecraft


Gauche
atheist
Gauche's picture
Posts: 1565
Joined: 2007-01-18
User is offlineOffline
Cpt_pineapple wrote:Actually

Cpt_pineapple wrote:

Actually I noticed lots of religious themes in the movie, mostly Panentheistic themes such as "Energy is borrowed from the spirits" or something of that effect, also the spirit tree and the way they view life/death were give aways.

 

 

 

 

What do you know about it you're only a former Pantheist.

There are twists of time and space, of vision and reality, which only a dreamer can divine
H.P. Lovecraft


smartypants
Superfan
smartypants's picture
Posts: 597
Joined: 2009-03-20
User is offlineOffline
BobSpence1 wrote:James

BobSpence1 wrote:

James Cameron didn't describe a religion, just a deep and justified concern for the way we are fucking the biosphere.

EDIT: The damage to coral reefs is one of the most clearly established direct effects of increasing CO2 , as well as rising temperatures. So his mention of that was entirely appropriate.

The movie was inspired by these concerns in a poetic and allegorical way, to create a quite respectable work of art. Art is one of the bests places to go when you get beyond religion, to feed the urges for mystery and wonder. 

 

Actually I think the hints that it was a tribal religion were somewhat misleading, as you say. But I suspect a lot of people on here might have a problem with my suspicion that we could have any sort of connection with the planet at all.

I'll go further and suggest that while religion is inflexibly dogmatic, it's Hollywood's great gift that it can recycle these concepts over and over and refine them. That is, it can present us with ever changing philosophies that can so easily adapt to the times in which we live.


smartypants
Superfan
smartypants's picture
Posts: 597
Joined: 2009-03-20
User is offlineOffline
Deadly Fingergun

Deadly Fingergun wrote:

smartypants wrote:
Are you a Cirque du Soleil type clown or a John Wayne Gacy type clown?
More a Pogo the Clown. I was Tartuffe, less homicidal, more of a humorous jerk. If you know the play, you get the name.

Those crazies at Cirque du Soleil actually work for a living. =(0.o)=

 

Sadly to admit, I don't know the play. But I just need to know, if I sit on your lap during my birthday party, will you touch me where my bathing suit covers?

Please?


Atheistextremist
atheist
Atheistextremist's picture
Posts: 5134
Joined: 2009-09-17
User is offlineOffline
Crikey...

smartypants wrote:

Deadly Fingergun wrote:

smartypants wrote:
Are you a Cirque du Soleil type clown or a John Wayne Gacy type clown?
More a Pogo the Clown. I was Tartuffe, less homicidal, more of a humorous jerk. If you know the play, you get the name.

Those crazies at Cirque du Soleil actually work for a living. =(0.o)=

 

Sadly to admit, I don't know the play. But I just need to know, if I sit on your lap during my birthday party, will you touch me where my bathing suit covers?

Please?

 

First spanking and now this? The plot slickens...

 

 

 

 

"Experiments are the only means of knowledge at our disposal. The rest is poetry, imagination." Max Planck


smartypants
Superfan
smartypants's picture
Posts: 597
Joined: 2009-03-20
User is offlineOffline
Cpt_pineapple wrote:Actually

Cpt_pineapple wrote:

Actually I noticed lots of religious themes in the movie, mostly Panentheistic themes such as "Energy is borrowed from the spirits" or something of that effect, also the spirit tree and the way they view life/death were give aways.

 

 

 

 

Except if you meet the analogy of a communication network head on, it becomes less like praying to the trees to heal your loved one and more like consulting a network of doctors on the internet with real time robotic interface to provide you with medical expertise. I concede that that might be a bit of a stretch with this film, but I maintain it could easily be interpreted that way if you so chose. 


BobSpence
High Level DonorRational VIP!ScientistWebsite Admin
BobSpence's picture
Posts: 5939
Joined: 2006-02-14
User is offlineOffline
smartypants

smartypants wrote:

Cpt_pineapple wrote:

Actually I noticed lots of religious themes in the movie, mostly Panentheistic themes such as "Energy is borrowed from the spirits" or something of that effect, also the spirit tree and the way they view life/death were give aways. 

Except if you meet the analogy of a communication network head on, it becomes less like praying to the trees to heal your loved one and more like consulting a network of doctors on the internet with real time robotic interface to provide you with medical expertise. I concede that that might be a bit of a stretch with this film, but I maintain it could easily be interpreted that way if you so chose. 

Especially if you note that the special communication with their animals and the trees requires actual physical interconnection. And it seems the trees actually communicate with each other via their root systems, and they 'study' other creatures with the help of their floating seed thingies. All very physical.

Favorite oxymorons: Gospel Truth, Rational Supernaturalist, Business Ethics, Christian Morality

"Theology is now little more than a branch of human ignorance. Indeed, it is ignorance with wings." - Sam Harris

The path to Truth lies via careful study of reality, not the dreams of our fallible minds - me

From the sublime to the ridiculous: Science -> Philosophy -> Theology


Deadly Fingergun
atheist
Deadly Fingergun's picture
Posts: 237
Joined: 2009-11-19
User is offlineOffline
smartypants wrote:Sadly to

smartypants wrote:
Sadly to admit, I don't know the play. But I just need to know, if I sit on your lap during my birthday party, will you touch me where my bathing suit covers?

Please?

Eww.

For that kinda clowning, call this fellow.

Big E wrote:
Clown
Why, yes, I am!


Renee Obsidianwords
High Level DonorModeratorRRS local affiliate
Renee Obsidianwords's picture
Posts: 1388
Joined: 2007-03-29
User is offlineOffline
With all the discussion, now

With all the discussion, now I REALLY want to see this movie  Eye-wink

 

Slowly building a blog at ~

http://obsidianwords.wordpress.com/


Deadly Fingergun
atheist
Deadly Fingergun's picture
Posts: 237
Joined: 2009-11-19
User is offlineOffline
Renee Obsidianwords

Renee Obsidianwords wrote:

With all the discussion, now I REALLY want to see this movie  Eye-wink

 

See, now everyone knows Gauche is really a talented shill.


Or maybe I'm the shill.

Crap, I forget.

Big E wrote:
Clown
Why, yes, I am!


Tapey
atheist
Tapey's picture
Posts: 1478
Joined: 2009-01-23
User is offlineOffline
Was a stupid movie. I wasted

Was a stupid movie. I wasted my time watching it. Was worse than 2012 and that was just random explosions for almost 2 hours.

Whatever goes upon two legs is an enemy.
Whatever goes upon four legs, or has wings, is a friend.
No animal shall wear clothes.
No animal shall sleep in a bed.
No animal shall drink alcohol.
No animal shall kill any other animal.
All animals are equal.


smartypants
Superfan
smartypants's picture
Posts: 597
Joined: 2009-03-20
User is offlineOffline
Atheistextremist

Atheistextremist wrote:

smartypants wrote:

Deadly Fingergun wrote:

smartypants wrote:
Are you a Cirque du Soleil type clown or a John Wayne Gacy type clown?
More a Pogo the Clown. I was Tartuffe, less homicidal, more of a humorous jerk. If you know the play, you get the name.

Those crazies at Cirque du Soleil actually work for a living. =(0.o)=

 

Sadly to admit, I don't know the play. But I just need to know, if I sit on your lap during my birthday party, will you touch me where my bathing suit covers?

Please?

 

First spanking and now this? The plot slickens... 

LOL @ "slickens"

I can get something perverted out of just about any thread, it's a talent really.


smartypants
Superfan
smartypants's picture
Posts: 597
Joined: 2009-03-20
User is offlineOffline
BobSpence1 wrote:smartypants

BobSpence1 wrote:

smartypants wrote:

Cpt_pineapple wrote:

Actually I noticed lots of religious themes in the movie, mostly Panentheistic themes such as "Energy is borrowed from the spirits" or something of that effect, also the spirit tree and the way they view life/death were give aways. 

Except if you meet the analogy of a communication network head on, it becomes less like praying to the trees to heal your loved one and more like consulting a network of doctors on the internet with real time robotic interface to provide you with medical expertise. I concede that that might be a bit of a stretch with this film, but I maintain it could easily be interpreted that way if you so chose. 

Especially if you note that the special communication with their animals and the trees requires actual physical interconnection. And it seems the trees actually communicate with each other via their root systems, and they 'study' other creatures with the help of their floating seed thingies. All very physical.

Exactly. More of an alternate type of biology than something mystical.


smartypants
Superfan
smartypants's picture
Posts: 597
Joined: 2009-03-20
User is offlineOffline
Renee Obsidianwords

Renee Obsidianwords wrote:

With all the discussion, now I REALLY want to see this movie  Eye-wink

Definitely try to see it in the theater in 3D. If you end up not liking the plot for some reason, the 3D special effects are still pretty astonishing to look at.


cj
atheistRational VIP!
cj's picture
Posts: 3330
Joined: 2007-01-05
User is offlineOffline
3D or not 3D

We saw it in 2 - my husband says that is just as well.  He has a little fear of heights and in 3D he may have lost lunch down the back of the person in front of him.  Just a warning.

As for the movie and/or religion and/or environmentalism, et cetera, et cetera.  I truly enjoyed the movie - it was visually beautiful, a complexly realized ecosystem, a satisfying if clichéd emotional and intellectual journey.  <spoiler, perhaps> There were hints of Sherri Tepper (Grass, et al), Elizabeth Scarborough and Anne McCaffery (Powers That Be, et al), some dragons from films like "Dragonheart" or perhaps Anne McCaffery's Dragonflight, and a whole lot of Greek comedy in the classical sense.  Religion?  No worse than Arthur C. Clarke or Robert Heinlein.  Environmentalism?  My first exposure to sci-fi environmental disasters was Andre Norton's Star Man's Son 2250 A.D.  Racist?  That one is tougher to address - my friend who is of mixed race did not think it was racist.  I thought maybe too many of the actors were white bread, but it seemed more of an oversight of the casting department than deliberate selection.  Try Robert E. Howard for real white bread.  Anti-military?  Naw - just the cuckoo sergeant.  And we all have met people who get a little tunnel visioned - just read through this blog!  Having been a Marine wife for 11 years of my life, I thought the military responses were exceedingly realistic.  Oo-Rah!

I have obviously been reading sci-fi way too much to be truly surprised by any plot twist.  Just save your critical thinking for another time.  It was a fun movie and I liked it MUCH better than 2012.  (I kept singing "Along came Jones" during the disaster scenes in 2012.)

--I feel so much better since I quit trying to believe.

-- I feel so much better since I stopped trying to believe.

"We are entitled to our own opinions. We're not entitled to our own facts"- Al Franken

"If death isn't sweet oblivion, I will be severely disappointed" - Ruth M.