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Another thought expirement: Religion and CPS

Posted on: November 29, 2009 - 3:35pm

Cpt_pineapple

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Another thought expirement: Religion and CPS

Say you are an agent in CPS [Child Protective Services]. A woman in town is saying she wants to kill her children because God told her to [They're sinners, or sacrifice whatever].

The child is then taken into your custody. A month later the mother sues for custody back. Now during the trial, she swears that she abandoned her religion. She even takes the blasphemy challenge. There is no evidence that she is still Christian or believes in God and all the evidence that she is no longer Christian and no longer believes in God.

Would you return the child?

Posted on: December 5, 2009 - 3:46pm #51

Deadly Fingergun

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Cpt_pineapple wrote:Stop

Cpt_pineapple wrote:

Stop with this strawman. I never said that enviroment has no effect. I never said that our behaviour is set in stone.

The actual fact of the matter is that personality is a rather good way of prediciting behaviour. No, it does NOT mean that the enviroment has no effect, that does not mean that the enviroment is irrelevant. What it does set a framework of how we would likely react to the enviroment.

I'll try to find that talk I saw posted here on how Democrats and Republicans are associated with their own personality traits. That is personality can be used to predict ideology! Does this mean that enviroment has no effect? NO! Does that mean you're not going to find people who don't fit the traits for Democrat who are still Democrat? NO!

Personality stems from environment.

Oops!

Big E wrote:

Clown

Why, yes, I am!

Posted on: December 5, 2009 - 3:51pm #52

Cpt_pineapple

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Since you gave me an

Since you gave me an example, I might as well give you one.

Take your little expirement in astrology. You said these were undergraduate and grad students. Wouldn't that mean they were in an enviroment in which rationalism was emphasized? Some were grad students, so I take it they were writing a thesis of some sorts. They were in an enviroment that encouraged sceptisim and discourse and questioning things. Yet, by your own accord they accepted magic more readily than science.

Posted on: December 5, 2009 - 4:01pm #53

Hambydammit

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So... you're not saying

So... you're not saying the environment has no effect. You're just saying faith has no effect.

And that's not special pleading?

Atheism isn't a lot like religion at all. Unless by "religion" you mean "not religion". --Ciarin

http://hambydammit.wordpress.com/
Books about atheism

Posted on: December 5, 2009 - 4:04pm #54

Cpt_pineapple

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Deadly Fingergun

Deadly Fingergun wrote:

Personality stems from environment.
Oops!

http://www.amazon.com/Entwined-Lives-Twins-About-Behavior/dp/0452280575

Twins seperated at birth show remarkable similarities, though they are not perfect clones

Hambydammit wrote:

So... you're not saying the environment has no effect. You're just saying faith has no effect.
And that's not special pleading?

NO, I'M NOT SAYING IT HAS NO EFFECT!!!!!

Posted on: December 5, 2009 - 4:04pm #55

Deadly Fingergun

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Cpt_pineapple wrote: Since

Cpt_pineapple wrote:

Since you gave me an example, I might as well give you one.

Take your little expirement in astrology. You said these were undergraduate and grad students. Wouldn't that mean they were in an enviroment in which rationalism was emphasized? Some were grad students, so I take it they were writing a thesis of some sorts. They were in an enviroment that encouraged sceptisim and discourse and questioning things. Yet, by your own accord they accepted magic more readily than science.

You're ignoring prior environment - from whence personality stems.

Oops!

Big E wrote:

Clown

Why, yes, I am!

Posted on: December 5, 2009 - 4:07pm #56

Cpt_pineapple

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Deadly Fingergun

Deadly Fingergun wrote:

You're ignoring prior environment - from whence personality stems.
Oops!

See the post above yours.

For example, in Hamby's example of height genes contribute 90%, diet and enviroment account for 10%

Posted on: December 5, 2009 - 4:35pm #57

Deadly Fingergun

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Cpt_pineapple wrote:See the

Cpt_pineapple wrote:

See the post above yours.

For example, in Hamby's example of height genes contribute 90%, diet and enviroment account for 10%

I"M NOT SAYING GENES HAVE NO EFFECT!!!!!!!11!!!one!!eleventyone!!

Sticking out tongue

Big E wrote:

Clown

Why, yes, I am!

Posted on: December 5, 2009 - 5:10pm #58

ClockCat

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So then...are people genetically predisposed to handling snakes and drinking strychnine because "God" will protect them? Are communities of people like this just a happenstance of similar personalities decided at birth?

If someone gets bitten or overpoisoned, and is slowly dieing...an the entire community, including that person fails to call for an ambulance, while quoting a bible verse that says god will protect them...is that something that religion had no influence over?

How about a mother homeschooled to believe the bible is the only truth, and the only thing that needs followed..that homeschools her children in the same matter, and then the entire family starves waiting for "God to provide"? Including an 18 year old, which raised in the isolation of homeschooling (to avoid non-religious teachings) lives in a world where God influences day to day activities and genuinely thinks that God will provide sustenance? Is religion unaffiliated with this?

Theism is why we can't have nice things.