Old Testesment

Scyth3s
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Old Testesment

How did one achieve salvation in the old testament?

 

Predetermined? Moral standard of living?

 

Other?


DamnDirtyApe
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 "Testesment"?  Like

 "Testesment"?  Like balls?  Fucking balls!

But in all seriousness, I suggest you start here for the Christian perspective

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dispensationalism

and keep in mind that Jewish views of the afterlife vary greatly throughout history and sect, so salvation might just mean that God will let you die without being covered up with your duly earned ration of pustulating sores, or that there is indeed some kind of resurrection of the dead.  In any case, sacrifice at the Temple or before the Mercy Seat (The angels on the top of the Ark in Raiders) was the way you covered your ass.  Also, it's quite possible that circumcision of male children was a kind of mock sacrifice meant to placate God in the absence of an actual child sacrifice (think Abe and Isaac).  

Hope this little bit helps you.

"The whole conception of God is a conception derived from ancient Oriental despotisms. It is a conception quite unworthy of free men."
--Bertrand Russell


DamnDirtyApe
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 I should point out that

 I should point out that Dispensationalism is what I'm most familiar with, and it's an invention of the 19th century.  Catholics and the rest actually follow a different point of view, but see if you can follow me here (and it makes me queasy to say this), Dispensationalism actually makes more sense than the other theories, partly due to the Dispensationalist obsession with the return of the Jews to Israel and their judgment/salvation by God.  The other denominations were classically happy to see all the Jews go to hell, so they never spent much time thinking about how OT Jews might have attained salvation.

"The whole conception of God is a conception derived from ancient Oriental despotisms. It is a conception quite unworthy of free men."
--Bertrand Russell


spin
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Salvation

Scyth3s wrote:
How did one achieve salvation in the old testament?

Salvation in the sense of what happens after this life wasn't a consideration in the Jewish religion. When you were dead you were dead. There is one biblical case I know of of someone being brought back from Sheol -- by magic -- (1 Sam 28), Samuel, and that was not very successful.

The notion of resurrection at the end of time seems to have been introduced into Judaism at the time of the Maccabean rebellion against Seleucid domination of Judea around 167 BCE. This is the period of the writing of Daniel, which mentions resurrection in the last chapter. A few other works of the time also refer to resurrection (2 Maccabees and 1 Enoch), the logic seems at the time that those fighting against the might of the Seleucids were at a great disadvantage psychologically and a second chance may have been seen as a way to encourage fighters. It's hard to assess the efficacy of the idea at that time and I'm not sure it gets picked up upon for a long time.

Jewish life has always been guided by torah observance. The righteous followed the law and accordingly they would see their seed flourish.

I think you had to wait until mystery religions offered salvation. In this respect christianity is a mystery religion. (Other religions which offered concepts such as the Elysian Fields (Roman) or Valhalla (Norse) worked on a good afterlife for the upright or the valorous. The rest of the dead population ended up in permanent dead storage.)

 

 

spin

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Scyth3s wrote:How did one

Scyth3s wrote:

How did one achieve salvation in the old testament?

Predetermined? Moral standard of living?

Other?

The OT is essentially silent on an afterlife. What little there is cannot be distinguished from a rhetorical device.

The OT religion is one where ALL the rewards and punishments are in this life both on the person and on his descendants.

Effectively there is no salvation, no afterlife, in that religion save for what has been copied to from other religions so as not to lose followers.

It's a convert eat convert world out there.