Evolution and God (if he exists) as "the Creator"

jread
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Evolution and God (if he exists) as "the Creator"

            Hey everyone. I wanted to post a specific topic concerning something I most recently learned from my research into evolutionary theory. After reading Ken Miller's book, Finding Darwin's God, I find that accepting evolution is an essential element in maintaining consistency within one's belief in God because God is said to be the creator of every living thing. If one believes that God is the creator of every living thing, then how can God be responsible for new strains of viruses and bacteria that are constantly evolving into new, never before seen forms? Is God always creating this new engineered organisms, and just duping the scientists into thinking their experiments are producing them? Because examples like this, I find it absolutely necessary for an individual who believes in a God that is also the creator to believe in evolution as means which creates on God's behalf. If one does not believe in evolution, then God must surely be infinitely busy "creating" new bacteria in laboratories every day. To me, it just seems so simple to explain the "creation" (if you want to call it that) of new life in terms of the evolutionary process because then God truly is the creator of every living thing. Of course, this assumes that God is behind evolution, which of course is faith-based and beyond the realm of scientific evidence. However, if one believes in God, it appears that accepting evolution in this modern world is a necessity if one is to maintain consistency within their belief as God the Creator. To reject it would be to live in a bubble of scientific ignorance and spiritual bankruptcy.

 

Note: If you're a Creationist and try to bring up the "micro evolution" vs "macro evolution" bologna, don't waste your breath. Arguing that position is clear evidence of your lack of understanding of evolution. Read a damn book (a good book) and then come back to ask your question, if you still wish to ask it.

The implication that we should put Darwinism on trial overlooks the fact that Darwinism has always been on trial within the scientific community. -- From Finding Darwin's God by Kenneth R. Miller

Chaos and chance don't mean the absence of law and order, but rather the presence of order so complex that it lies beyond our abilities to grasp and describe it. -- From From Certainty to Uncertainty by F. David Peat


thingy
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That's why I've always been

That's why I've always been so confused about the hatred of evolution.  It doesn't do anything to disprove god what so ever, all it does is prove that that the early parts of the bible are mere parables and allegory.  Just because they're parables and allegorical it does not make the lesson taught in them any less valid.  It doesn't make the religion itself any less valid. You can take the entire old testament as a parable and still be fine.  In fact it'll be better off because it then means that yahweh isn't this homocidal power hungry complete and utter bastard.

The only threat christianity has is in insisting jesus was a historical figure.  If they had left him in the mystical realm where the gnostics and other precursers to christianity placed him, along with gods of every other religion are then they'd have nothing to fear from knowledge, science, and questioning. The council of nicea really shot themselves in the foot there.  Are there any versions of christianity today that don't base their beliefs of jesus being historical?  Islam gets shot too, they list jesus as a prophet.

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nigelTheBold
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thingy wrote:That's why I've

thingy wrote:

That's why I've always been so confused about the hatred of evolution.  It doesn't do anything to disprove god what so ever, all it does is prove that that the early parts of the bible are mere parables and allegory.  Just because they're parables and allegorical it does not make the lesson taught in them any less valid.  It doesn't make the religion itself any less valid. You can take the entire old testament as a parable and still be fine.  In fact it'll be better off because it then means that yahweh isn't this homocidal power hungry complete and utter bastard.

The only threat christianity has is in insisting jesus was a historical figure.  If they had left him in the mystical realm where the gnostics and other precursers to christianity placed him, along with gods of every other religion are then they'd have nothing to fear from knowledge, science, and questioning. The council of nicea really shot themselves in the foot there.  Are there any versions of christianity today that don't base their beliefs of jesus being historical?  Islam gets shot too, they list jesus as a prophet.

As soon as you claim the early parts of the Bible are allegorical, then you have to ask, "Which other stories are allegory, rather than fact?" Suddenly, you have to interpret the Bible as if it were mystical in nature, and not revelatory. That takes thought, and it makes it harder to support your specific interpretation, as an allegoircal Bible would be open to many different interpretations.

Then, you can no longer claim that you and your eight closest friends are the only ones who truly understand the Bible, and are the only ones going to Heaven.

And you have to think. Fundamentalist Christians don't like to think about their religion.

That's why so many folks are seriously stuck on the literal truth of the Bible, even though Jesus in the Bible spoke often in parables.

So all you damned evolutians with your religious belief in Darwin are just tools of Satan, trying to blaspheme the absolute Word of God. Oh, and you're Nazis in disquise, too.

"Yes, I seriously believe that consciousness is a product of a natural process. I find that the neuroscientists, psychologists, and philosophers who proceed from that premise are the ones who are actually making useful contributions to our understanding of the mind." - PZ Myers


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What evolution does is

What evolution does is eliminate the necessity for a special creator for living things. Before the idea of evolution, god was a necessity for life on earth, and provided a very powerful basis for belief. With that base destroyed by evolution, the foundations of faith are shook as well.

 

More importantly, the idea of evolution negates the entire point of "original sin". If god did not create humans in a special act of creation, if he did not put them into a garden of eden, if the entire interchange between god and the tree and Adam and Eve never happened, how could god brand humanity with "sin". Furthermore, how is "sin" even a useful concept in the context of evolution? After all, we are merely the products of blind algorithmic processes, so how could we be possibly blamed for our imperfections? Without original sin, there is no reason for Jesus to come to earth. Without a reason, there is no point in him dying and being ressurrrected, and without that, christianity lacks a point.

 

 


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I really like the chapter

I really like the chapter 'The road back home". Miller does a great job of explaining why evolution and God are not mutually exclusive. In fact, I wrote a topic about creationism a while back.


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Evolution is not abiogenesis

Evolution is not abiogenesis is not cosmology is not an argument for or against god.

 

Atheism isn't a lot like religion at all. Unless by "religion" you mean "not religion". --Ciarin

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