Ray Comfort on Rational Response Squad tonight 9pm, 11pm et!

Sapient
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Ray Comfort on Rational Response Squad tonight 9pm, 11pm et!

 

Tonight is the Ray Comfort night!! The following is a post that I made on a few Christian forums:


Recently I had the opportunity to talk to Ray Comfort (Christian author, Radio show host, and famous Evangelist). Ray is well known for several arguments, many of which have been posted right here on this message board. The most well known is his argument that atheists don't exist. This argument has two huge flaws. The first flaw is that he defines atheism in his own manner. He claims all atheists know for sure God doesn't exist, yet that is an extremely small percentage of atheists. Atheists, are of many variety, most are similar to what you might consider and agnostic. Simply put atheists are anyone who isn't a theist. They (we) are (a)=without theism.

So, he starts with a strawman and then tears it apart with his redefinition of atheism, a definition that sadly many Christians ignorantly adhere to. The other huge problem with the atheists, don't exist argument is that it effectively washes all Christians out of existence as well. Ray claims that atheists must confess in the knowledge they don't have they must admit there could be evidence for God, yet he forgets that in the knowledge that Christians don't have they must hold to the same standard... they must admit there is a chance that evidence exists which prove God doesn't exist. Ray goes on to give an example that he only needs to find gold in a mans tooth in China to prove God exists, which is of course a ridiculous example. Ray claims to "know" for sure God exists, that he doesn't "believe" and that is why he doesn't need to hold to the same standard he wants atheists to hold to. Of course if Ray had any universal evidence for his god, something that he could claim empirical knowledge, something that is 100%, there would be testable and falisifiable scientific evidence for God. I think most of you would agree. In fact most Christians if not almost all admit they believe based on faith. Listen to the show, and hear me confront Ray on these points, however depending on what side of the theistic fence you sit on, you may say "Ray is confronting Sapient" not the other way around. 

Ray has another famous argument, from his Way of The Master videos with Kirk Cameron in which he claims that the banana is evidence of intelligent design. In fact ironically, this is actually a great example of natural selection at work. The banana has flourished in part because it has been eaten and its seeds have been released through fecal matter. Were the banana impossible to open with seeds on the inside, it wouldn't have lasted long, and in fact there are many plants and trees that have seen that particular fate. Additionally what does one make of the pineapple or coconut? Those are neither easy to eat or open. Claiming the banana is evidence of intelligent design is no different than me claiming that the pineapple is proof that no god exists.

And here are two more examples that you will hear in the show: Zucchinis are intelligently designed for the anus, and the gp120 protein of the HIV virus is intelligently designed perfectly to fit with the CD4 protein of a childs T-cells. Praise Jesus!

I am frustrated in myself that I didn't present the best arguments on the show, it's prerecorded, if that wasn't clear. I had computer problems that delayed our discussion about 30 minutes, and had me running around the studio like a chicken with it's head cut off. I along with several friends are willing to debate and discuss any points I've made here or any arguments that Ray Comfort makes for that matter. Feel free to discuss how Sapient gets beatdown by Ray Comfort after you listen to the show. Sticking out tongue There is an illusion to Christians who insult atheists in the show, Ray calls them out. Here's a free clip of that. (if you hadn't heard Mikebboy was deleted from myspace for abuse this week- too many threats to kill peoples pets)

The full broadcast of our discussion will air several times on internet radio in the next few days, starting tomorrow night:

Freethoughtmedia: Friday, April 28th, 9pm est (join/debate the show hosts in RationalResponders.com chatroom)

Freethoughtradio: Friday, April 28th, 11pm est (join/debate the show hosts in RationalResponders.com chatroom)

ProgressiveBlendRadio: Saturday: 3pm est, Sunday 1am est

Revereradionetwork: Tuesday, May 2nd, 11pm est

All the show hosts will be in the chatroom for a little party and discussion during both broadcasts on Friday. You can also tune in, without visiting the site, by opening this player.

Here's a little show preview for your enjoyment.

My prized possession from our discussion a Ray Comfort edition of the bible, autographed! lol If you care to offer money for this item, I will gladly donate the money to "The American Red Cross."

OTHER COMFORT VIDEOS:

Here is the longer google video from the above selection.

And even better, how to witness to a gay.

 

 

 


Equilibrium
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Ray Comfort on Rational Response Squad tonight 9pm, 11pm et!

Won't be here at 9, i'll probably be home for the 11pm show.


qwak
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Re: Ray Comfort on Rational Response Squad tonight 9pm, 11pm

Sapient wrote:

And here are two more examples that you will hear in the show: Zucchinis are intelligently designed for the anus

woo! HOT DAMN!

music

http//www.myspace.com/antiqwak


Susan
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Ray Comfort on Rational Response Squad tonight 9pm, 11pm et!

It is opening night at the theater where I volunteer.

Alas, I will not be able to join you all tonight.

Atheist Books, purchases on Amazon support the Rational Response Squad server.


Archangel__7
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Re: Ray Comfort on Rational Response Squad tonight 9pm, 11pm

Sapient wrote:
Simply put atheists are anyone who isn't a theist. They (we) are (a)=without theism.

Well there's no disputing that. But I think the dispute here is that while this is certainly a *necessary* condition for atheism proper, this criterion alone is not *sufficient*. Pantheist = not-a-theist. Deist=not-a-theist. The problem with that criterion appears that it's just too vague to be very useful except to say "I'm something other than a theist"

Sapient wrote:
...they must admit there is a chance that evidence exists which prove God doesn't exist.

But Brian, Ray's argument isn't intended to prove that "therefore theists are right". Rather, the conclusion being defended is that --at least on this count-- "atheism proper is not defensible". There are many other options other than the theism/atheism dichotomy, so your rejoinder merely brings the argument to a Scottish verdict, which suffices to diffuse positive atheism, so construed.

Sapient wrote:
Ray goes on to give an example that he only needs to find gold in a mans tooth in China to prove God exists, which is of course a ridiculous example.

I can't say much for the merits of Ray's argument here. As it stands, I'm not sure how it succeeds. At any rate, what remains true is that the given form of his argument is valid and can be shown simply by observing how the propositions oppose each other:

Let G be "God" where: (x) ~Gx ---- (∃x) Gx

These two statements are formal contradictions of one another: if one is true, the other must be false. If one instance of an x is found to be God, by necessity the given proposition opposing it must be false. Though Ray's form of argument is valid, I agree he will have to do more to demonstrate his argument is sound proof for the existence of God. But in my estimation, there are probably much better examples of just such arguments from Christian philosophers elsewhere, and I trust Comfort would readily agree with that.

Sapient wrote:
Ray claims to "know" for sure God exists, that he doesn't "believe" and that is why he doesn't need to hold to the same standard he wants atheists to hold to.

I think Ray would be well within his epistemic rights to make that claim if he indeed had a veridical encounter with God in his life. It's not going to be evident in some empirical way such that the substance of this experience can be analyzed or tested, but I suspect this is largely due to the fact that science as construed by most naturalists, simply excuse the relevant criterion from the outset. So of course there will not be evidence sufficient enough to satisfy the demand. Nonetheless, Alvin Plantinga's work on Warrant provides some initial grounds for considering that Ray's experience might well secure his right to claim true Knowledge of God's existence. I'll have to forego expounding on it here though in favor of listening to the radio program --which appears is about to begin in 15 minutes.

At any rate, I look forward to hearing your further insight on these matters, Brian. And thanks for the DVD!!


knldgspwr
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Ray Comfort on Rational Response Squad tonight 9pm, 11pm et!

How can god not exist in atheists if he does not exist?
I guess the easterbunny also doesn't believe in the a-easterbunnieist?